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John Cobin Shaw
I was reading your website. Yes, I can give plenty of detailed information about systematic torture of children in the Florida School for Boys at Okeechobee, and less detailed information about the same in Marianna.
I was one of those who was first very nearly, almost murdered and badly injured, refused medical care for serious, life threatening injuries, real serious injuries, and then tortured while in the bloody clutches of that goddamn sadistic state of Florida.
I have never forgotten it, and have even appealed to forces in foreign countries to make the bastards pay for it, with some degree of achievement, and I do not mean "pay for it" in the monetary sense, though they owe that too.
What, if anything, can I do to help?
John G. Shaw BLS
10 April 2009
TERRORISM, TORTURE, GROSS ABUSE, INTENTIONAL INFLICTION OF HORRIFIC PAIN, VIOLATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS AS SYSTEMATIC POLICY IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA. SYSTEMATIC SADISTIC FLOGGING OF CHILDREN.
The state of Florida had a sadistic policy of exploiting children from lower-income, broken homes, and torturing them to bloody pulp through the use of weighted leather flogging straps. As many as 40, 60, 80, 100, and more lashes were perpetrated against children as young as nine to sixteen.
The immediate results of such ferocious treatment were double vision and partial blindness, with the skin beaten black as coal, and skin torn off leaving flowing blood. Many boys were beaten so violently their underwear became ingrained with their bloodied, injured skin and muscles, and had to be surgically removed at a hospital. The policy consisted in intentional, systematic infliction of extreme, horrific, skin-searing pain equal to pouring boiling water repeatedly over the skin, or pressing a red-hot steel plate to the skin repeatedly, plus the weight of a three pound or four pound leather paddle with a sheet-metal insert slamming down hard against skin and muscle.
Long term results were severely lowered self esteem, lifetimes of anger, physical, emotional, and mental scarring, distrust, frustration, failed marriages, violence, inabilities to bond and express love, and immense psychological problems, among other problems. These children your state spit on were kept in continual states of terror of being savagely, ferociously beaten for the smallest of infractions such as talking about going home, smoking a cigarette, not smiling, using the wrong tone of voice, and talking after lights out.
I was present at many beatings at the Florida School for Boys at Okeechobee. Some kids were beaten unconscious. One boy was systematically tortured for several weeks. One young boy was severely beaten at the Arthur G. Dozier School for Boys at Marianna, became paralyzed, was sent home, and died four days later. Another boy ran away from being tortured at FSB Okeechobee. He was found shot between the eyes. His name was Patrick Timothy Gabriel.
For more detailed information on this topic, you can google this: The White House Boys. Theirs is only part of the story. This is not an advertisement. Nor is this an attempt at selling a book. This is an exposition of state sponsored torture and terrorism by the state of Florida.
There were also corruption, incompetence, and exploitation in the city governments of Florida. I, myself, know of examples where known serial-felons in our community who committed several felonies against me were protected by police from arrest and prosecution. Their felonies were never recorded, even after they became common knowledge in the community.
There is a great deal more to these stories than you will ever know. When you read crime statistics of small towns in Florida, you might want to add some points. Many offenses do not make it onto the books, including the crimes committed by your state and their agents.
This story was written by a primary source witness.
Try googling these. The White House Boys. Arthur G. Dozier School for Boys. Florida School for Boys at Okeechobee. Torture and murder at Florida reform school. Florida exhumes graves of boys allegedly tortured and murdered.
The torture of children by agents of the state was officially outlawed in Florida in 1967. We believe various forms of state-sponsored abuses against children who are vulnerable to such exploitation continue.
There was this one black kid who was locked up in the adjustment unit for at least six weeks I know of. They beat him repeatedly for six weeks at least. The guy went crazy. The first beating was about 100 lashes. I am not sure exactly how hard they hit him each time. That poor guy was making all kinds of noises I never knew a human being could make. When they came for him again a few days later he went absolutely nuts. He was screaming and crying like I had never heard anyone do. I think they had to get people to drag him out of his cell and hold him down on the bed. A few days later they came to get him again. By this time he knew he was in for the beating of his life. He had transformed into a screaming, crying, sobbing, begging, pleading bundle of complete terror. His buttocks had been beaten to mush. He bled, leaving bloody foot prints on the clean terazzo floor.They came for him again a few days later. I can only say the beating they gave him that day was intended as the death penalty, but worse. The kid was beyond being able to utter intelligible words. He was beaten blind, unable to speak, unable to think. He could make only deep throated and gutteral sounds that resonated through his body and echoed into my mind and my soul forever. I can never forget it. After that, whenever they came for him again he would go what we might call absoloutely nuts, screaming, and making the wierdest animal-like noises. Even the sound of foot steps near his cell door, or the sound of an opening door would set him off into a frenzy of insane, sceraming and yelling. On the bed he would settle into his torture sessions with deep gutteral noises that kept rolling down the hallway. I don't know what that kid did to bring all that much pain and terror into his life. For days I listened as the beatings went on and on. He screamed. He begged. He called out to God. He called out to his mother. He begged them to beat him on a part of his body different from the part being slammed and seared repreatedly with the wrap-around flogging srap. God did not enter the adjustment unit that day. Nor did his mother, the police, or lawyers. It was only himelf and two or three white men. Those men were absolutely cold, cold, with hearts of stone.
You think I wasn't scared? I was terrorized. Other kids held in that vile place were scared out of their wits.There was no telling who would be next, when I would be next. When would they come for me? Well, they did come for me. I think they came for all of us.
You know, I turned in a prominent principal of a school because he was a child molester. I knew exactly what he had done and to who. They needed me out of the way because I was a witness to his actions and to the criminal actions of others. I have no idea why an allegedly legitimate government had more interest in protecting adult serial felons in the community than they had in protecting victims of crime, but I say a government of that nature needed to be looked into.
And, that principal I turned in went free. They locked me up. There were others in the community with similar records of serial offences, all of who were reported to the authorities repeatedly, but who continued living freely with police protection from arrest and prosecution. Don't try to tell me how wonderful Florida was and is. There should be a sign at the state line warning all persons of low-income, disadvantaged backgrounds what underlying intentions the state has toward them and their children.
In reference to your note on the internet asking for information about abuses inflicted by the state of Florida, I assure you without any question whatsoever, some of the people running those state schools for boys were sadistic bastards. They most certainly did torture kids systematically. They beat kids much worse in the Florida School for Boys at Okeechobee than at Marianna in 1965. I was present at many beatings at Okeechobee in 1965-66. They beat kids to bloody pulp. I mean that literally. Frank Zych, Donald Johns, and Emmet B. Davis really seemed to enjoy their blood sport. In the mid sixties the beatings in Marianna were child’s play compared to the bloody torture going on in Okeechobee. I knew quite a few guys who were beaten in Marianna in 1966. It was mild and light compared to the ferocious, sadistic torture meted out in Okeechobee in 1965. We heard stories about beatings and rape rooms that came down to us from before 1965 in Marianna, and they were horrific. I do not know exactly when they beat Roger Dean Kiser in the face, but the story of it was still legend in Marianna as late as 1966, and I heard the story myself.
I was there when frank Zych was being interviewed by a woman who identified herself as a reporter from some newspaper; I think it might have been the Palm Beach Post. I heard the questions she asked. I was right there. I heard the answers he gave. Zych was lying through his goddamn teeth. The state put Tidwell, the one armed man, in Marianna, and Zych, the one legged man, in Okeechobee. John Howard was a cottage father in Marianna some time around 1965-66-67. He was a kindly man. I met Troy Tidwell quite a few times, but he did not treat me badly. I know very little about Tidwell. We know he beat kids. There is no question about that.
In the town I was from, Stuart, Florida, government and police had peculiar ways of enforcing the law. For example, numerous crimes, misdemeanors and felonies, were committed against me by serial adult-felons living in the community. When I went to the so-called authorities to report the crimes, they simply failed and refused to function; they did nothing about it. I remembr clearly going to police and authorities with legitimate complaints, and getting answers like “Tough shit,” “That’s too bad,” “That’s your problem,” and “Things are tough all over.”This kind of thing went on for years. However, if I did anything wrong, they could swing right into action–against me. The system was either incompetent, corrupt, or both. Some people in the state system, and some in the local systems were not there to help children. Believe me, helping kids was not their function.They were there to hurt children. They were there for themselves because they were too low-grade to get better jobs anywhere else.
I read the part on the web page that said black kids were beaten worse than white kids. When it comes to Marianna, I cannot substantiate that statement. Blacks and whites were segregated. However, in Okeechobee they tortured both blacks and whites in the same room in the so-called "adjustment unit." I was there for seventy days, and for seventy days I counted all the lashes. The blacks definitely got more whacks and harder whacks; this was true in general, but not always. I counted the number of lashes kids received many many times. They even tortured mentally disabled children who should not have been there to begin with. In those days in FSBO, if a kid got twenty-five whacks it was favoritism. I know some got sixty whacks and more. Some got 100 lashes and more, believe it or not. I mean what to hell. I was there. The state should be investigated; it should also be attacked.
You may think my version of going to the law and being refused the service is an exaggeration, but consider these facts in more recent times. This may seem improbable to you, but I assure you without any question whatsoever, it is true. I was working in a college in South Korea in 1997 when I obtained detailed information about the-then coming attacks of September 11, 2001. From 1997 and up to and through the night of 10 september 2001 I told about 130 people about these attacks. Many times I named the exact targets, the commandeered, fuel-laden aircraft, people from Saudi Arabia, and the approximate time of the attacks. In 1998 I told Danny Carey of the Martin County Sheriff’s Department in detail. No follow-up. No investigation. No nothing I know of. In early 2001 I told a Mr. Osborne of the DOC, in detail. He twirls his finger in the air and says, “Sure, and I suppose they are flying around here right now.” No follow-up. In early 2001 I called 911 in Stuart and told them of a terrorist or guerrilla presence in the area, that they were planning attacks, and using airplanes. The night of September 10, 2001 I called some number in Fort Pierce; it was some bold print, seven digit number on the inside front cover of the phone book. I warned of a major terrorist attack coming “very soon.” I will admit, this guy really was digging for more information. I did not mention details as I had in other warnings. I reported these coming attacks openly in three countries to law enforcement people, experienced, educated people, not some rookie on the beat.
In late 2000 I was in e-mail communication with the office of Governor JEB who I told I had some very interesting information that he or most anyone might find useful. I advised him I did not make statements like that lightly. I was planning to lay all the 9-11 information I had on the table to him. In the meantime a letter came from INS stating this: If you bring your children from China to the US, they will become wards of the state. To me that was a very offensive and threatening statement against my babies. I have told you here what “ward of the state” means in my mind. After that letter I withheld further information about 9-11. I have written a manuscript covering the incidents of 9-11. It is 90-pages and over 54,000 words.
Can you expect such a person as me to try and save your day from catastrophe while your government is telling me they are predicting catastrophe for my children? Besides that, I told your law enforcement personnel in plenty of detail about the coming attacks. If they would not inform you and do something, and you are paying their salaries, why should I? Your state would not give me a job, even after I gave them perfectly good, detailed, information about major terrorist attacks against your own interests. What to hell people. You must be kidding. I mean, how goddamn negligent and stupid can a government be? I joined the military. They used real terrorist tactics against me. I survived it. Many others were killed, and many more were horribly mutilated. Again, I go to government with perfectly legitimate complaints, and once again I am ignored. Well, we saw their towers crashing down in 2001, and their pentagon in flames. I had known in quite some detail about those attacks since 1997. Those arrogant bastards in power could ignore me, but I guarantee you they could not ignore what happened on September 11, 2001.
I am not putting up a front to make a good impression. After what the so-called government system did to me, I really do not care if your government gets attacked. If your own officers are going to be that negligent, you get what you have coming. At any rate, you solicited for information about torture and abuse by agents of your own state government. I assure you, they did beat kids to bloody pulps, and they did systematically torture some. No question about it. I do not personally know of of Troy Tidwell's being that hard on anyone, but my knowledge where he is the matter is very limited. Where Zych, Johns, and Davis are the subjects, I can tell you they were so ferociously, sadistically hard on kids that when I told people precisely and accurately what they had done, nobody ever believed it. It really was unbelievably cruel, and so unecessary, and not legitimately called for in any way. They just wanted to hurt people. What the state did to hundreds, perhaps a thousand children, perhaps thousands of children was far worse than sexual predation. It was bloody torture, sadism, terrorism, and gross exploitation, and a violation of human rights .
Here is one example of the kinds of underhanded, black hearted, criminal offenses committed against me while in the bloody clutches of your tax-paid agents. After many felonies had already been committed against me, and the perpetrators had been protected by your government from arrest and prosecution, the put me in a jail cell for getting drunk. OK. I was fifteen or sixteen. I got drunk. I did not hurt anyone. I did not steal anyone’s money. In fact, in a broad scale of human equivalents, I did not commit any real offence. Sure, it was illegal to get drunk at my age. It was also much more illegal for people to do to me what they had done, but those power-crazy ass holes running your government simply overlooked those matters, and focused their predatory skills on children they saw as most vulnerable to the kinds of sadistic exploitation they had in store for them. Unfortunately, I was one of those children.
So, they put me in a cell with this truculent, homicidal guy who had gone psycho after having sniffed glue for something like almost every day for six months. This guy was about sixteen, and so messed up from sniffing glue his teeth were rotting out of his mouth, his skin was a pasty, ghostly white with patches of dead skin, and his hair was falling out. He told them he would murder me if they put me in the cell with him. He was raving about some big conspiracy, having conversations with imaginary people, and blaming others and me for his incarceration. They put me in the cell anyway. The guy kept inventing conversations in his own mind in which I had supposedly insulted him. It was crazy out of this world. I could be there completely quiet, and this guy would just jump up with a knife made of a long, jagged piece of glass, and start yelling, "What? What did you say? Don't ever say that to me again." I asked several times to be removed from the cell. He was threatening to kill me. Anyway, this guy attacked me several times. He was insane. You had to be there to understand how grossly unreasonable this whole thing was. He had a long piece of broken mirror and tried to slash my throat. He missed the throat but caused a deep slash on my shoulder so the bone was clearly sticking out of my body and visible. There was blood all over the place.
I begged and pleaded many times to be let out of there. I begged and pleaded for some kind of medical care. The guards refused several times to let me go for medical attention. One advised him on how to lie in case there was an investigation. A so-called youth counselor named Henry Beckman came to visit. I told him what happened. He ignored it. They had actually encouraged the guy to do it. It was a lot worse than you might think.
The bastard who attacked me got out. I lay there for weeks sliced open. I got an infection from it. I got sick. And my poor mother. I covered it up, and did not let her see what had happened when she came to visit me.
After all this they drove me to the Florida School for Boys at Okeechobee, still without any care or medical attention whatsoever. They beat me bloody. They gave me fifty-three lashes. My buttocks were black as coal, torn, and bleeding. I ended up spending seventy days in solitary confinement in their so-called adjustment unit. No explanation was ever given for the beating or the confinement.
There were many other offenses against me. Here you have read about only a few. Florida's government was unconstitutional, brutal, indifferent, sadistic, and criminally offensive toward me. Is it any wonder that after obtaining detailed information about the attacks of 9-11-01 in 1997 I withheld information from the authorities?
John Gobin Shaw
'The Stuart News News / accent Wednesday, October 15, 1980 D1 John Shaw of Stuart survives and serves in Ireland’s most disastrous train wreck Awarded Army Acclaim medal By MARY ETTINGER News Staff Writer'
'COUNTY CORK, Ireland --- As the train carrying 230 summer passengers approached Buttevant station in southern Ireland traveling more than 70 mph, it suddenly left the main track and collided with a stationary train. The result was the worst rail disaster in Ireland’s history. A Stuart man, John G. Shaw Jr., a passenger in the most critically damaged section of the train, freed himself and other survivors from the wreckage and organized the earliest life-saving first aid at the scene. The United States Army, recognizing his meritorious achievement, awarded Pfc. Shaw the Army Commendation Medal and a commendation citation.'
'Shaw, stationed near Frankfurt, Germany, but on leave in Stuart because of his father’s death, remembers vividly the disaster of last August 1. He was talking to other passengers, on his way to Cork to see the Blarney Stone.I was thrown against the seat back; there was a loud grating noise and screaming; everything disintegrated around me and things were flying through the air. Then things quieted down and he dug himself out from the rubble. The first thing he saw was a lacerated man pinned under a heavy weight and in pain. Shaw freed the man and moved to another section of the train wreckage where he found a woman with her leg chopped off below the knee and a man in the same situation.'
'County Cork newspapers reported that many of the eighteen bodies recovered were horribly mutilated some having been cut in half, from being crushed beneath the tangled wreckage. Several of the coaches just behind the engine jack-knifed and ricocheted across four sets of track, totally demolishing the dining car and two coaches. Only three of the passenger carriages remained upright on the main track after the crash.”
'Shaw treated victims for shock and organized small groups of able survivors to care for the injured, quickly teaching them basic first aid measures. When medical personnel arrived, he familiarized them with the crash scene by leading them to the most seriously injured people.The Army citation states that Shaw carried supplies and injured passengers helping to restore a semblance of order in a tragic and chaotic situation. His prompt, direct, and keen sense of duty reflects great credit upon him and the United States Army. The soldier says he learned ways to handle emergency situations in his advanced individual combat training at Fort Dix, N.J. The Army’s training really works. He explains that the basic training most personnel go through builds stamina and gives hands-on training in shock treatment, splints, and survival, in addition to methods of firing various small arms.'
'More than 50 people were injured in the crash, many seriously, prompting the biggest rescue operation ever undertaken in the state, according to Shaw. Rescue workers were ready because because of the Southern Health Board’s major disaster plan drawn up some ten years ago and kept current with twice-a-year drills. A fleet of twenty ambulances, helicopters, and teams of doctors and nurses sped to the station from several area hospitals. The country’s largest mobile crane, weighing 115 tons, and a 75-ton crane were brought in to help clear the wreckage, freeing survivors and uncovering bodies.'
'The cause of the accident was not clear, and Shaw is still trying to find out the results of the investigation. He said it probably was due to some work being done on the tracks near the station and subsequent failure to divert the train to the proper track in time. '
'Shaw, 30, is a native of Stuart. He is the son of Inez Shaw and the late John Gobin Shaw. He is in the transportation section of the 21st Replacement Battalion in Frankfurt. Shaw is working on a degree through the University of Maryland majoring in history. He says he is getting a real sense of history while traveling through Europe.'
'Shaw's family goes back through a long line of ancestors who served the country. An early forefather was a captain in a battalion of Berks County Associates in the Jersey campaign of the Revolution in the summer of 1780, and later commanded a company of militia sent to protect the settlers. A later relative was a Pennsylvania state senator and chaplain of the 110th Pennsylvania Volunteer Infantry, and another served in the War of 1812. Shaw’s great-uncle, John Peter Shindel Gobin, was a brigadier general in the U.S. Army, state senator and lieutenant governor of Pennsylvania, and major general commanding the Pennsylvania National Guard.'
John Gobin Shaw wrote:
Many Felony Terrorist Threats Came Before Buttevant and Bologna Mass Human Slaughters.
Self-admitted terrorists in contact with terrorist cells in Europe told me for six months about two terrorist slaughters “arranged and guaranteed” to happen. One would be a derailment made to look like an accident. The other would be an obvious terrorist event. They reminded me no fewer than fifty times to remember the word (phonetically) Eireann because that was the name of one of the organizations that had “arranged and guaranteed” one of the events. The felony terrorist threats were much more detailed and extensive than mentioned here. Coras Iompair Eireann admitted responsibility for the human slaughter I survived in Ireland on August 1, 1980, but only for an accident due to negligence; however, I assure you, any honest person who , if he / she had heard all the terrorist threats that came before the killings in Ireland and Bologna, would not accept without question Coras Iompair Eireann’s accident-version of derailment.
The two self-proclaimed terrorists in Frankfurt-am-Main, Germany who made all the threats were Sergeant John P. Vogel and Specialist Stavrinakis, both of the United States Army. This information is NOT meant to mislead or to libel in any way. The threats were quite specific and happened. The two mass killings happened. The terrorist threats and what happened in Buttevant, County Cork on August 1, 1980 and in Bologna, Italy August 2, 1980 were too strikingly similar to have been merely coincidental. If you had heard the threats, you would be able to follow this, exactly .
After six months of precisely worded terrorist threats I got Specialist Stavrinakis before an informal hearing. I was trying to get witnesses and an official record of the threats. That way I would have a record of the threats if something happened later. Stavrinakis stated at the hearing that he had never made any threats. He said he had no idea what I was talking about. He lied about everything exactly like a criminal thug. What about those innocent poor people slaughtered and cut into pieces at Buttevant. Look at the people blasted apart in the train station the morning after my train was derailed. If they had survived, I think they would have known what Stavrinakis and Vogel had been threatening. Witnesses in Germany were warned not to speak out. Nobody wanted to get involved.
I mean get real, people. I told my roommate, Jimmy Rowe, they would derail my train in Ireland three months before it happened, but only to be accused of being paranoid. Then, three months later it happened. This is all true. Do not be deceived by governments that murder with impunity. I was right there in Frankfurt and saw witnesses threatened with retaliation if they gave testimony. They assured certain retaliation against any children witnesses might have in the future. These were US Army fascists doing the threatening. They admitted having contacts with terrorist cells in Europe.
More on terrorist threats preceding Buttevant and Bologna.
So, we have six months of continuous terrorist threats in which the self-proclaimed terrorists tell me repeatedly to pay special attention to the precise wordings of the threats, and they tell me 50 or 100 times to remember the word pronounced Eireann, and I assure you those figures 50-100 are not an exaggeration. Then, we have 104 people killed and 265 injured in two human slaughters, both in train stations in one 24-hour period on my line of travel, and I just happen to be in one of them and survive it, and the train company’s name just happens to be Coras Iompair Eireann.
I was aware the derailment had been “arranged and guaranteed” to happen. I positioned myself in the train deliberately to increase my chances of surviving it. My surviving it was not a matter of chance or luck. It was by conscious effort and design that I survived it, and, there must be a God, whatever God is.
I will tell you something else you are not able to believe, but because it is all factual I will tell you anyway. Back in 1997 I obtained detailed information on the-then coming attacks of September 11, 2001. I knew exactly where they would strike, about the commandeered, fuel-laden aircraft, only approximately when they would be executed, and I was aware of the people from Saudi Arabia. I told about 130 people about the attacks before they happened, and you know what, telling people about those coming attacks was about as useful as telling you all this information now, for I am sure you will generally ignore it. I did not get one iota of recognition for warning about those attacks, but politicians and media personalities in the USA and elsewhere got tons of recognition lying through their teeth about those attacks after they happened. Exactly what kind of a world is this anyway?
I have written a 90-page, 54,000 word document detailing getting precise information about the coming attacks of 9-11-01 in 1997 in South Korea, and telling others about them for four years right up to and through the night of September 10, 2001 in Fort Pierce, Florida. The threats in Germany, the slaughter in the derailment in Ireland, and the bomb-massacre in Bologna the following morning are mentioned in this manuscript at some length. I did not contact the FBI, CIA or other agencies in the USA about the coming attacks in Washington and New York. They had refused to perform their sworn duties on crimes by Stavrinakis and Vogel back in the 1980s, and I assure you I did quite a bit back in the USA to try and get those two questioned and brought to court, but only to be ignored for the most part. They ignored my rights and the rights, safety, and security of my children. When the situation became reversed I ignored theirs. However, I did tell about 130 people, some of who were in law enforcement, who ignored it all and let it go.
I assure you I had done nothing wrong or illegal in any way when the terrorists started making their threats. I had been poor, pennyless, living on the streets, and waking up homeless every morning in the country my ancestors had founded. I joined the army because I needed a job, and that was all. Those two bastards, Stavrinakis and Vogel, mounted a hate campaign of terrorist threats. It was fascists in the US Army who protected them from arrest and prosecution. I never threatened anyone in any way shape or form.
I notice the duty station near Frankfurt where those bastards had been stationed was the site of a car-bomb explosion on August 8, 1985 exactly five years to the day after I returned there after surviving my “arranged and guaranteed to look like an accident” mass killing in Ireland. That was the car-bomb attack at Rhein Main Air Force Base. I too was stationed at RMAFB. When you read about such attacks as that one there are considerations you might want to keep in mind.
People in the US military were involved in felonious, terrorist offences similar to the kinds of attacks made back against them . The US government and their military are able to conceal (cover-up) the facts of their own crimes, to highly publicise retaliatory strikes against themselves, to censor information, and to label attacks against themselves as terrorism. They use terror tactics and you never hear about it. Use the same back against them, and headlines across the globe scream out in large capital letters—TERRORISM. Therefore, they have the power and they win, but they are still illegal and wrong. That’s the way it goes. When you screw people around you make enemies.
Quoted words in this report / article are exact terrorist threats uttered by Stavrinakis and Vogel before the mass human slaughters in Ireland and Italy. Not after. BEFORE. I did not make any of the threats. I did not threaten, intimidate, harass, or attacks anyone even in the slightest way.
How about that.
John Gobin Shaw
November 24, 2011